Men's Reproductive Rights

[over-man]

Okay. I tried this topic before but it went way off topic and turned into a flamewar. For the purpose of this discussion let us assume that abortion is an inherent right of women's. Don't post here saying that you disagree with abortion, it does not add to the discussion.

The main foundation of abortion is Women's Reproductive Rights. The notion that women have the right to opt out of motherhood by having an abortion.
When pro-lifers say that consenting to sex is consenting to parenthood, pro-choicers say this is not the case, that consenting to a sexual encounter does not automatically make you a parent, UNLESS you are a man.

Why do our laws protect sexual promiscuity among women, but punish it among men?

I would not be creating this thread unless I was ready to be called a sexist chauvenist pig for bringing it up, so let it begin.

[Syron]

You sexist chauvenist pig!

now that's out of the way i'll answer by saying that in law there is no such thing as equality of the sexes.

[removeduser_487563287433]

The father has a right. The obvious problem is, however, that should the parents disagree then you have to provide the legal recourse so that one can decide should there be a split. Frankly I feel the woman should have the final right to decide.

This then causes the problem of child support that a father will have to pay even though it may have been his choice to pursue an abortion.

[Gary88]

the women has to push it out of her vagina...to put it bluntly (but acurately) although that raises the should the man pay for it if he didnt want it argument

[over-man]

The father has a right. The obvious problem is, however, that should the parents disagree then you have to provide the legal recourse so that one can decide should there be a split. Frankly I feel the woman should have the final right to decide.

This then causes the problem of child support that a father will have to pay even though it may have been his choice to pursue an abortion.

This is where men's reproductive rights come in. The male can opt for a male abortion ONLY early in the pregnancy and drop any responsible of being father. Sure he's a terrible father, but doesn't he have rights?

[Kennylz]

The women pushing it out her vagina argument is one of the least reasons you'd leave the choice to her. Mainly, you'd let her have the choice, cause it grew inside her, and she already has atleast 50% say in what happens to it, since its half hers. The reason its always her choice is because she is holding all the cards.

If you tell a crazy woman she cant have an abortion she will just throw herself down the stairs.

With that said, the 'pain of birth' is not a factor. Men make up for it by having balls that are constantly kicked throughout their life time.

[JP226]

to put it bluntly (but acurately) although that raises the should the man pay for it if he didnt want it argument

where else would the baby get "pushed" out of? The *******?

I think a man deserves just as much right as the woman does. And using the pro choice POV, it's half his and if he didn't want the child, then he shouldn't have to pay for it.

[over-man]

The best argument I hear against MRR is that if men drop responsibility it would force a women to have an unwanted abortion, which would be tragic. But then again, many women have unwanted abortions already for various reasons.

[Gary88]

With that said, the 'pain of birth' is not a factor. Men make up for it by having balls that are constantly kicked throughout their life time.

, they dont know how much it hurts do they maybe if seamen were the size of marbles men would have more rights

[JP226]

The best argument I hear against MRR is that if men drop responsibility it would force a women to have an unwanted abortion, which would be tragic.

and if the man wanted the child and the woman didn't?

[Woad-Warrier]

and if the man wanted the child and the woman didn't?

Tough peanut butter.

[JP226]

Tough peanut butter.

and that is where the double standard lies.

[mongoose]

It's important to keep in mind that the woman is the one physically carrying the damn thing, so while the man contributed 50% to the creation, the 9 months of development has nothing to do with him.

[LoZz]

in the eyes of the uk law a baby is 50/50, both mother and father have equal rights over the child, infact in the uk their is a push among the government for a law to force men to sign the birth certificate to stop dead beat dads doing a runner(this law will also help men who want to be a part in their childs lives even against the wishes of the mother).

however this only applys to babies, and unborn fetus doesnt count. i 100% understand your point though. the man help made it, he should have a say in it. i also understand your point about women can just choose to end motherhood threw abortion but if the man has sex with her he is stuck with it. but at the end of the day birth and pregnancy is something the women goes threw alone, a man helps her get their, and he helps just as much afterward but during that stage its her and as such she should have the final say.

however their is no need for a law or anything like that. the reason i say this is because 99% of women will talk about abortion with their partner first, comming to an agreement before making a choice, now while their are exceptions the only time the women goes off and gets the abortion by themselves without the fathers approval is when the father is no longer in the picture, in which case he forfits his rights imo.

now like i said, their are exceptions but we(men) have to realise that very few women treat abortion like a form of protection. MOST women in a relationship regardless of if its marriage or a girlfriend/boyfriend relationship will come to an agreement with their partner first, its very rare for them to go off and do it behind the mans back as women have feelings and are very aware of other feelings. my mother buys "ok" and "Hello" magazines and ive read stories in their of women who kept their baby because their partner didnt want an abortion (part of a story on women who desided not to abort) so women do take into consideration the mans view. most cases i think the man will agree to abortion on the basis they will try again later, now as a man as long as i get a child at some point i wouldnt mind too much.

[Kennylz]

Someone needs to tell god to fix this whole, man, woman, biology problem.

It's holding up our equality! God is a chovonist! Why does the woman have to be the one to have the baby. Its almost like they were ment to raise the thing once they came out of them. You know, with lactating and all.

Very politically incorrect, god. -Finger shake-

[over-man]

Another funny double standard: If a mother doesn't take care of her kids, SS takes her kids away. If a father doesn't take care of his kids, SS takes his money away.

[JP226]

It's important to keep in mind that the woman is the one physically carrying the damn thing, so while the man contributed 50% to the creation, the 9 months of development has nothing to do with him.

She didn't have to have sex in the first place. It's about responsibility. If both sides had equal rights abortion levels would drop because they'd actually have to think about what they are getting into.

[over-man]

Someone needs to tell god to fix this whole, man, woman, biology problem.

It's holding up our equality! God is a chovonist! Why does the woman have to be the one to have the baby. Its almost like they were ment to raise the thing once they came out of them. You know, with lactating and all.

Very politically incorrect, god. -Finger shake-

Like how SeaHorses do it? The mother creates the baby and the father carries it and gives birth to it.

[LoZz]

Another funny double standard: If a mother doesn't take care of her kids, SS takes her kids away. If a father doesn't take care of his kids, SS takes his money away.

SS, lol nice one

but in seriousness its not true.


if mother doesnt take care of the kids, SS give them to dad, unless dad is no better then mum, inwhich case they go to care. a story in the dail mail today of a bussiness woman who went to jail, her kids went to their dads, not care.

remember SS is a government run thing, they dont like spending money unless they have too.

and its visa versa for dads who dont take care of their kids, however the situation you described would benifit men, they still keep their kids!

[killerchinchilla]

Its a difficult situation, ideally a man should be able to opt out of having the child just as a woman can, but I can't see any way of doing that. There is also the issue of women not informing the men about the pregnancy, in which case they have no way of influencing the out come and must put up with the result and, even of they want to be a father to the baby they will often have that right taken away from them. I don't think abortion should be presented as a right to choose as that makes the lack of a mans right to do the same sexist.

Interesting side note, in America and its probably the same here if a woman forces a man to have sex ('rape') and it results in a pregnancy the man is still held responsible for the child's upkeep.