Hamas attacks southern Israel

[PointOfViewGun]

So what exactly happened here?
I am not a practicing christian, but surely arresting (looks more like abduction by thugs) the consul's bodyguard (who should also have diplomatic immunity?) inside the church during a holy day for orthodox christians (resurrection of Christ) is about the stupidest thing Israel can do.
What's the excuse for arresting him, then?

There have been more serious cases against Christians in Jerusalem that went largely unnoticed or people just don't care if its Israel's doing.

Jerusalem Christians rally round Armenian Church over land deal

The heads of the Christian Churches in Jerusalem issued a rare joint appeal at the weekend, warning that a contested land deal could erase the centuries-old presence of the Armenian community within the Old City.

However Armenians say they risk being uprooted by a deal to lease about 25% of their area to developers who want to build a luxury hotel on the site.
The deal was signed by the head of the Armenian Church in Jerusalem in July 2021, but members of his community said the first they heard of it was when surveyors started work in the area this year.
He has told his congregation that he was misled and has started legal action to get the contract annulled. The priest who brokered the accord on his behalf was defrocked by the Church Synod in May and he has left Jerusalem.

Despite the legal challenge, bulldozers arrived last week and started tearing up a carpark, which covers some of the contested land. When protesters blocked the work, armed Israeli Jewish settlers turned up in a failed effort to disperse the demonstration.

Jerusalem: Armenian Christians fight controversial land deal

When Israeli bulldozers arrived at the contested site to try to begin demolition, Armenians rushed to block it. The next month, there were claims of intimidation as the developer arrived with several armed men.
Further attempted incursions came after the protest tent was set up. The most violent was last month when masked men came to the car park beating people with sticks and using tear gas. A priest, Father Diran Hagopian, broadcast events on Facebook Live.
"They were shouting, 'you should go out from this land'," he later told the BBC. "One of their leaders was shouting: 'You can break their legs, you can even kill them, but they should leave.'"
The apparent involvement of known Jewish settlers in attacks alongside other evidence has increased long-held suspicions that a powerful settler organisation is involved in the attempted land takeover.

Jerusalem ‘land grab’: Armenian community fear eviction after contentious deal

Last autumn, Xana sent bull*dozers, flanked by armed settlers, into the plot they say was signed over. The pile of *rubble on which priests said new year prayers was created on one of these incursions.
Armenian activists have so far managed to hold them at bay. Young Armenians raced to the site to serve as human shields; they have since set up a permanent camp, with security guards and a tent offering warmth, food and tea.

Many Armenians see echoes of the controversial sale by the Greek patriarchate of two large hotels in the Old City to Ateret Cohanim, which promotes and funds Jewish settlements in and around the Old City. The church challenged the deal, saying it involved bribery and *conspiracy, but lost its case.

Many in the Armenian community think it is no coincidence that an issue that had been brewing for years erupted when world attention was focused on the Israel-Gaza war.

There were an average 10 demolitions of housing units a month in the first nine months of 2023, but after the 7 October attacks by Hamas, the average monthly rate of demolitions increased to 17, Haaretz reported.

[Kyriakos]

It's been 22 hours since Quds News reported this, but it still appears nowhere in mainstream Western or Israeli media, as far as I can tell, which is odd considering how much the international media loves this stuff. The video is obviously of some real event, but Quds News isn't exactly a reliable source. They've also recently reported the absurd claim that Starbucks Coffee is a major financial backer of the IDF. The Quds News website was blocked in the West Bank by the Palestinian Authority for its alleged association with Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad.

Has the Greek government confirmed the incident?

There’s an Arab-Israeli Orthodox Christian journalist who has been there. This post seems to be indirectly addressing the claim: https://twitter.com/YosephHaddad/sta...32710025040016

Although, he's obviously quite pro-Israel.

Some major greek newspapers mention it, along with information that the guard has now been released, following diplomatic or state intervention. Eg: https://www.ethnos.gr/World/article/...rembashtoyypex

So it wouldn't be a ruse or fake.

Article mentions that no explanations have been given by now.

[sumskilz]

There have been more serious cases against Christians in Jerusalem that went largely unnoticed or people just don't care if its Israel's doing.

No doubt Rothman, the wily Jewish banker, plans to bulldoze a Christian orphanage. He was wise to bring his hired goons along, Armenian monks are well known for their martial prowess:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

That being said, either the patriarch or the priest are lying:

The patriarch denied knowing the exact terms of the lease, and claimed that a local priest, Baret Yeretsian, signed the contract on his behalf. The clergyman in question has in the meantime been defrocked and has reportedly sought refuge in Pasadena, near Los Angeles.

In an interview with the Associated Press in June, Yeretsian said that Rothman plans to develop a high-end resort in the Armenian Quarter, which would be managed by the One&Only hotel company based in Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, which established diplomatic relations with Israel in 2020.

Yeretsian dismissed fears of an Israeli takeover of the Armenian Quarter as “propaganda” based solely on Rothman’s Jewish identity. “The intention was never to Judaize the place,” he said, claiming that Rothman has no political agenda. He insisted that the Armenian patriarch was fully engaged in the long-running negotiations and personally signed off on the contract.

Actual photo of Rothman in his Dubai office:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[PointOfViewGun]

No doubt Rothman, the wily Jewish banker, plans to bulldoze a Christian orphanage. He was wise to bring his hired goons along, Armenian monks are well known for their martial prowess:
That being said, either the patriarch or the priest are lying:
Actual photo of Rothman in his Dubai office:

Resorting to slandering Armenians of Jerusalem as a whole now, I see. Looks more like opportunism of Israeli settlers making use of a corrupt priest. Israeli thugs attacking the protests is not something you can trivialize though.

[sumskilz]

Resorting to slandering Armenians of Jerusalem as a whole now, I see. Looks more like opportunism of Israeli settlers making use of a corrupt priest. Israeli thugs attacking the protests is not something you can trivialize though.

I don’t doubt your sincerity, as I’ve never met a greater advocate for justice on behalf of the Armenian people.

[PointOfViewGun]

I don’t doubt your sincerity, as I’ve never met a greater advocate for justice on behalf of the Armenian people.

What you're indirectly suggesting would mean that I'm better at recognizing the opposite. It's not a great picture to out yourself this way. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[mishkin]

It is surreal that we are waiting for Israel's imminent new massacre. It is also surreal that those who yesterday commemorated an atrocity are preparing to carry out another today.

[Paul Atreides]

It is surreal that we are waiting for Israel's imminent new massacre. It is also surreal that those who yesterday commemorated an atrocity are preparing to carry out another today.

Pro-"Palestinian" people should encourage the terrorists to surrender and release the brutalised hostages. If not, FAFO.

[PointOfViewGun]

Pro-"Palestinian" people should encourage the terrorists to surrender and release the brutalised hostages. If not, FAFO.

Are you saying it was FAFO for Israel when October 7 happened as they could stop the Gaza siege and West Bank encroachment beforehand?

[Paul Atreides]

Are you saying it was FAFO for Israel when October 7 happened as they could stop the Gaza siege and West Bank encroachment beforehand?

I guess it was. They learned that "Palestinians" really cannot be trusted, coexisted with or negotiated with. So, time to take out the Hamas trash.

[mishkin]

Pro-"Palestinian" people should encourage the terrorists to surrender and release the brutalised hostages. If not, FAFO.

Yes, Pro-Palestinians have been denouncing for years the Israeli paramilitary apartheid regime and that Israeli prisons are overcrowded with Palestinians, in this same discussion we have talked about it.


2023. Before October 7
Israel holds over 1,200 detainees without charge. That’s the most in 3 decades, a rights group says

JERUSALEM (AP) — Israel is holding over 1,200 detainees — nearly all of them Palestinians — without charge or trial, the highest number in over three decades, an Israeli human rights group said Tuesday.

The detainees, 99% of whom are Palestinians, are held under Israel’s policy of “administrative detention,” without trial and under allegations that Israeli authorities keep secret.

the famous administrative detentions of the great democracy of the Middle East.

[Paul Atreides]

Yes, Pro-Palestinians have been denouncing for years the Israeli paramilitary apartheid regime and that Israeli prisons are overcrowded with Palestinians, in this same discussion we have talked about it.


2023. Before October 7
Israel holds over 1,200 detainees without charge. That’s the most in 3 decades, a rights group says



the famous administrative detentions of the great democracy of the Middle East.

Especially after 7/10/2023. it seems that it is safer for Israeli citizens to keep brutal terrorists (or are they POWs?) locked away than let them run around murdering and raping civilians - they are at war with your Pally-friends, after all.

"Funnily" enough, in every other Middle Eastern country they'd probably be treated rather more harshly.

[PointOfViewGun]

I guess it was. They learned that "Palestinians" really cannot be trusted, coexisted with or negotiated with. So, time to take out the Hamas trash.

Are you saying that decades long siege of Gaza and dissection of West Bank was a form of trusting, coexisting and negotiating with Palestinians? Interesting thinking.

[Kyriakos]

Let's not pretend that many people hold the position that Israel killed 10.000+ children because it was so anxious to have 100 something hostages released.
But hey, maybe that is a Hamas number and the dead palestinian children are closer to 50.

Yes, the middle east is filled with horrible regimes, and then Israel still manages to take the cake; much like having depressed and violent people as neighbors and deciding to kill them, their families and their friends.

[PointOfViewGun]

Especially after 7/10/2023. it seems that it is safer for Israeli citizens to keep brutal terrorists (or are they POWs?) locked away than let them run around murdering and raping civilians - they are at war with your Pally-friends, after all.
"Funnily" enough, in every other Middle Eastern country they'd probably be treated rather more harshly.

Is it only OK when Israel holds children "hostages" under unknown charges?

What Palestinian Children Face in Israeli Prisons

An estimated 10,000 Palestinian children have been held in military detention over the past 20 years, with Save the Children noting that they are “the only children in the world who are systematically prosecuted in military courts.” As of Nov. 20, Israeli forces had arrested as many as 880 Palestinian children this year, a practice made possible under Israel’s draconian military laws.

The youngest child who was released by Israeli authorities during the ceasefire was Ahmad Salayme, a 14-year-old boy. Salayme was arrested in May for throwing stones in a Jewish settlement in occupied East Jerusalem. (Settlements are considered illegal under international law.)

How Israel jails hundreds of Palestinians without charge

In a family home in Bethlehem, in the occupied West Bank, Yazen Alhasnat was sitting next to his mother rubbing sleep from his eyes.
The 17-year-old had been released from prison the night before, nearly five months after being arrested in a 4am Israeli military raid on the home.
Yazen had been held under "administrative detention" - a longstanding security policy, inherited from the British, that allows the Israeli state to imprison people indefinitely without charge, and without presenting any evidence against them.
"They have a secret file," Yazen said. "They don't tell you what's in it."
He was back at home because he was among the 180 Palestinian children and women released from prison by Israel in the recent exchange for hostages held by Hamas in Gaza.

Palestinians have been subject to administrative detention in this region since 1945, first under the British Mandate and then in the Occupied Palestinian Territory. The law has in some very rare instances been used against Israeli settlers, but it is overwhelmingly used to detain West Bank Palestinians, including children.
Administrative detainees are granted a hearing - at a military court, in front of an Israeli military judge - but the state is not required to disclose any of its evidence to the detainees or their lawyers. The detainees can then be sentenced to up to six months. But the six months can be extended indefinitely by the military court, meaning that administrative detainees have no real idea at any point how long they are going to be locked up.

Yazen, Osama and Musa were all released early, because the exchange for Israeli hostages prioritised women and children. But, according to the most recent numbers from the prison service, there are still 2,873 people being held under administrative detention in Israeli jails.

[Paul Atreides]

Are you saying that decades long siege of Gaza and dissection of West Bank was a form of trusting, coexisting and negotiating with Palestinians? Interesting thinking.

Perhaps arabs should either
1) stop starting wars they cannot win
2) learn that losing every war you start disqualifies you from dictating terms to the winners
3) learn how to fight wars in order to win - this will never happen, the West will never allow another holocaust
4) learn that coexisting with jews is better than harboring and supporting a corrupt, undemocratic, homophobic, islamofascist terror enclave and firing rockets at your neighbours while the kleptocratic Arab leaders are whoring and snorting their stolen billions away in some safe heaven.

I would add 4) move to a country which has been made "Judenfrei" and is more compatible with your belief system and preferred method of governance, but as we know, not one Arab country let's them in - for obvious reasons.

[mishkin]

It is surreal that we are waiting for Israel's imminent new massacre. It is also surreal that those who yesterday commemorated an atrocity are preparing to carry out another today.

and the surrealism of the racist and xenophobic extreme right siding with the Jewish state of Israel. I don't know if it will be treated in history books or in psychiatric manuals.

[Paul Atreides]

Is it only OK when Israel holds children "hostages" under unknown charges?

Yea, it is rather tragic that "Palestinians" start their terrorist training programs for their children so early. Perhaps they should learn more useful life skills - of course, building tunnels and operating explosives is a useful skill if you want to make it in the construction business. Perhaps the kids throwing stones were practising to become professional baseball or cricket players (probably too "Western)?

BTW, what charges are the Israeli kids kidnapped in the raid facing under the "Palestinian" "judicial" system? What did they do?

[mishkin]

The Palestinians have not kidnapped anyone. Why are you writing Palestinians in quotation marks?

[Paul Atreides]

and the surrealism of the racist and xenophobic extreme right siding with the Jewish state of Israel. I don't know if it will be treated in history books or in psychiatric manuals.

Yes, yes, everyone is a crazed moon nazi eating babies for breakfast, hell bent on the destruction of the "good" people, usually the Arabs and the russians.

You'd think that the left-wing lunatics are even funnier for you :"We hate unequal, corrupted, kleptocratic, homophobic, mysogynistic, islamofascist dictatorships - unless they are killing Jews!"