False advertising- what if a fan launched a class action lawsuit?

[Ebenezer Grymm]

The day we can sue companies for making games we don't like is the day companies stop making games. There's no case here.

You're right that suing because you don't like a product is "no case".

That's not what the case would be though.

The case would be because the product is faulty. "They removed family trees waaaaa!" would get you laughed out of court. But "This product is performing in a substandard way in its technical performance, essentially malfunctioning" would and should be solid.

[AngryTitusPullo]

Opponents of this thread are bringing up the same ideas.
Let me profess and enlighten.

This:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Has nothing to do with the game I currently have installed on my computer.
No matter how high I turn graphical settings it doesn't reach this level of detail.
This is what people call false advertising.

Isn't there always a disclaimer where it says work in progress or something and may change ? Maybe the original design proves using too much resource so they have to tone it down until the engine is better optimize ?

[Smiling Hetairoi]

A bit silly to sue them over Rome 2. We all knew it was going to be bad after all.

[omzdog]

Isn't there always a disclaimer where it says work in progress or something and may change ? Maybe the original design proves using too much resource so they have to tone it down until the engine is better optimize ?

Wow, you're really bending it for them aren't you?

[Payai Dunai]

You're right that suing because you don't like a product is "no case". That's not what the case would be though. The case would be because the product is faulty. "They removed family trees waaaaa!" would get you laughed out of court. But "This product is performing in a substandard way in its technical performance, essentially malfunctioning" would and should be solid.

We must be playing different games, because Rome II is nowhere near "essentially malfunctioning". People are really getting desperate here.

[Ebenezer Grymm]

Wow, you're really bending it for them aren't you?

He/she isn't "bending" anything. They're right. Companies put the "this product may change" disclaimers out there to prevent exactly this sort of thing.

The OP and this whole false advertising thing are in the right forest but they're barking up the wrong tree.

What I mean by that is there's a case to be made against bugged software releases, but it's not false advertising or because you don't like certain features/lack of features. It's because of technical performance issues. You can equate it to pretty much any physical product you want. Say you buy your kid a Transformer from Toys R Us. You go to return it with one of two reasons

a. My kid doesn't like that Optimus turns into a truck, he wants a plane instead
or
b. This thing was busted out of the box with broken legs and missing stickers

B. is going to get your money back either there on the spot or in a court if you have to go that far. A. is going to get you a "Sorry about your luck." Rome2TW is B.

[=Vastator=]

I haven't noticed anything that they said would be in that isn't.

Even then, they say "Things can change between now and release" for a reason.

Sure, you can talk so about gameplay, but they can't declare such low minimun requirements when you have no hope to run on it with such PC.
Here's a my thread where i explain this: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...m-requirements

[Baleur]

It ain't gonna happen. Because this is the games industry. Laws don't apply.

1. You don't get refunds on Steam even though your local fair trade laws (and international laws) override anything you agree to in a TOS or EULA in digital purchases. A company can NEVER negotiate away your right as a customer to regret your purchase within 14 days. Yet in the games inudstry, they can, despite it being illegal. And there's not a thing you can do about it.
2. They can release tampered screenshots and fake trailers, then provide a product that is broken and proven to not be the same as they advertised. Despite international fair trade laws regarding product quality, EVEN digital products, which dictate that a customer has rights to a full refund (in cash, not another game) if a product is in a conclusive way broken or does not live up to expectations. Yes folks, "does not live up to expectations", by law you have right to a full monetary refund within a few days if you simply do not like the game you just bought compared to what you expected from the PR campaign before. Yet in teh games industry, this doesn't matter, despite it being illegal they refuse you refunds if the product is broken or doesn't live up to expectations. And there's not a thing you can do about it.

The games industry ladies and gentlemen. A cess pool of literally illegal anti-consumer practices. And nobody is being punished, prosecuted or investigated.
Because games are just silly things kidz play, they can't be taken seriously and as such laws do not apply, right?
*sigh*

[omzdog]

Showing us these long spectacles and previews of huge cities and fancy unit display and formations only to put a little "results may vary" sticker in the corner.

[clausewitzz]

I'm currently filling out the paperwork for a class action lawsuit. I'll have it submitted by the end of the week to a jurisdiction suitable.

[Caesar_1991]

Are you really comparing company screenshots to the finished game? First my friends a photographer and he edits the hell out of photos. Spruces them up real nice. Screenshot looks edited to me. Second, look at Medieval 2's box screenshots. Smooth as silk. Even at max, completely max you don't see that level of clarity. Third, really? Your whole case rests on claiming of false advertisement. Heres a thought, what if you or anybody else misinterpreted what CA said. I'm guilty of that. Even if this somehow made it to trial you would have to win or you would pay monstrous amounts of legal fees. Also the 7 millions people would not join you.

[Burebista]

Law suit or not - something has to be done in order to put pressure on the Producers and Managers who allowed for this problem to happen. Get signatures and petition all gaming newspapers and sites, this will certainly get CA's attention. Ask for the heads of the managers who didn't play the game and are really superficial in releasing such a product. Make them do a taskforce and ask Community/Modder help to solve this mess. Allow the community to view the bug list and comment on priorities and workflow - CA must think outside the box and stop supporting leaders that don't actually ever finished one game campaign.

To me this looks like a product that still needs 6-8 months of development and they know it.

?Who of you would buy a car that does not behave in reality as marketed and has some huge issues that make it more of question of luck if you get it to drive it without incidents every trip?

My biggest issue is the graphics/textures.

[Caesar_1991]

I'm currently filling out the paperwork for a class action lawsuit. I'll have it submitted by the end of the week to a jurisdiction suitable.

Wow. Hope to god that this is a joke

[Ebenezer Grymm]

It ain't gonna happen. Because this is the games industry. Laws don't apply.

1. You don't get refunds on Steam even though your local fair trade laws (and international laws) override anything you agree to in a TOS or EULA in digital purchases. A company can NEVER negotiate away your right as a customer to regret your purchase within 14 days. Yet in the games inudstry, they can, despite it being illegal. And there's not a thing you can do about it.
2. They can release tampered screenshots and fake trailers, then provide a product that is broken and proven to not be the same as they advertised. Despite international fair trade laws regarding product quality, EVEN digital products, which dictate that a customer has rights to a full refund (in cash, not another game) if a product is in a conclusive way broken or does not live up to expectations. Yes folks, "does not live up to expectations", by law you have right to a full monetary refund within a few days if you simply do not like the game you just bought compared to what you expected from the PR campaign before. Yet in teh games industry, this doesn't matter, despite it being illegal they refuse you refunds if the product is broken or doesn't live up to expectations. And there's not a thing you can do about it.

The games industry ladies and gentlemen. A cess pool of literally illegal anti-consumer practices. And nobody is being punished, prosecuted or investigated.
Because games are just silly things kidz play, they can't be taken seriously and as such laws do not apply, right?
*sigh*

^This guy gets it.

Don't worry though, change is coming. If you consider modern gaming and gamers starting with Atari then gaming and those gamers ages are still only ~35 years old. As time goes by and every year the average age of gamers gets older we'll have more intelligent people with more money and more time who are more aware of their rights fight for this stuff and eventually we'll see change. I'd say within the next 10 years is an extremely safe bet. Because as you said "games are just silly things kidz play" actually was applicable ~25 years ago in the time of Nintendo and the early stages of PC gaming, but those times are quickly coming to an end, and those gamers are grown up with new gamers entering the fold in a digital age where rights concerning ownership and acceptable standards of performance for digital products are going to have to be, and will be, addressed.

[Daneboy]

I wonder if that could ever happen? Not that I want to start one myself. But it seems like many fans are on forums/etc... when there is technically a legal route that could be effective. Just something to think about.

Go ahead.

Any court - all over the world - would most likely dismiss the case. Kind of hard to prove a financial loss over AI inactivity or whatever.

[Elsasser]

First of all, what is wrong with you people trying to talk others out of trying to take legal action. We have those rights and should even be encouraged to use them if we feel that we should.

[Elsasser]

Secondly, if you can make a case out of it or not can best be decided by a lawyer specialized in advertising and such. Not laymen on the forums.

Things like false advertising might be a bit weak, even though I remember a case where a company was successfully sued for using to much photoshop on one of their female models.

Hardware requirements sound a bit more solid in making a case wise, but I am no more an expert than you, so I can't tell, but companies get successfully sued for not declaring contents or requirements sincerely enough which can in some cases amount to fraud.

Mind you, it's a judge or a jury who decides wether this is the case, not common sense or ,thank god, people on this forum.

Sorry for double post, forum didnt act like i wanted to.

[Daneboy]

First of all, what is wrong with you people trying to talk others out of trying to take legal action. We have those rights and should even be encouraged to use them if we feel that we should.

Sorry, but it would seem like wasting the courts time for something real unimportant compared to "real" courtcases.

Better try the consumer authorities instead. There you might just - most unlikely - get anywhere if it is false advertising you are complaining about.

[GrudgeNL]

I'm currently filling out the paperwork for a class action lawsuit. I'll have it submitted by the end of the week to a jurisdiction suitable.

I am going to spread this around the internet. LMAO. Everyone deserves to have a good laugh once in a while.

[hospitaller13]

Its pretty criminal, i see no reason why you couldn't.