SSHIP - General Discussion

[kostic]

@louigi: This is indeed the kind of unpleasant surprise that SSHIP can reserve.
As for wedding rings, this is not the first time I have noticed that they are unreliable!
Help @Macaras! Is there anything you can do to improve this aspect? For example: an alliance cannot be broken if the relations are good and the reputation is reliable?

[Elendil 03]

What's your policy about including minimods in official releases? Looks like Umbra made some serious work (that's also very relevant to SSHIP's overall objective) here, it would be a shame if this became incompatible with the next release.

[Macaras]

@louigi: This is indeed the kind of unpleasant surprise that SSHIP can reserve.
As for wedding rings, this is not the first time I have noticed that they are unreliable!
Help @Macaras! Is there anything you can do to improve this aspect?

The wedding is just an alliance, I wouldn't expect marriage to be a peacekeeper in 100%, there are no special rules in descr_campaign_ai_db about marriages, only alliances.

an alliance cannot be broken if the relations are good, and the reputation is reliable

It is already there, if the reputation is very reliable and the relations are good, the allies should keep the alliance except some situations:
1. if they grow to more than 7-10 cities. In case of Venice, Sicily if they are bigger then 7 cities, the allies are no bound by this rule anymore, which doesn't mean they will automatically attack.
2. if human is too strong overall (like 1.5 stronger than neighbor).
2. if the game passes 150 turns.

If one of the Italian states has 8 or more cities- you are rich. Just keep money for the situation like this, if they attack - pay for peace before the war really starts. Another thing - don't send your armies through another faction territory, with every step the relations go lower, the bigger the army the faster they will dislike you for this.

Unpleasant surprises are exactly what they are supposed to be, so that the player doesn't feel secure and having everything under control. Otherwise, you would just make alliances with strong ones, war with the weaker and win the game without doubts. The fun is when you lose few cities and then reconquer them. I can see why Novgorod, Norway, Serbia etc. are difficult, but Italians are relatively easy- big, rich cities, well developed, good unit roster etc. Last thing - watch your neighbors if they are at war with other factions. This is the only 99% sure indicator, if they are engaged in another fronts you will be left alone.

[kostic]

What's your policy about including minimods in official releases? Looks like Umbra made some serious work (that's also very relevant to SSHIP's overall objective) here, it would be a shame if this became incompatible with the next release.

@Umbracatervae's work is enormous and superb indeed! I downloaded his mini-mod and I intend - if the author allows it - to integrate his work into our version.
On the other hand, if the new version comes out soon, I won't have time to integrate it because I am currently busy making special units for garrisons which require time...

[umbracatervae777]

@Umbracatervae's work is enormous and superb indeed! I downloaded his mini-mod and I intend - if the author allows it - to integrate his work into our version.
On the other hand, if the new version comes out soon, I won't have time to integrate it because I am currently busy making special units for garrisons which require time...

Of course i'm allow it to integrate.
If my mini-mod is not integrated yet in new version, I will update my mini-mod to match with the new version myself

[Sint]

Gun units have been nerfed to compared to 6.4 and whoever is responsible for the archer ranges clearly doesn't know the difference between flight and war arrows.

[Sllhouette]

i was surprised to see most crossbows and bows gain equal range. gives all missile units more competitive ability. does negate the point of longbows though, and crossbows being slower/shorter but harder hitting. good or bad i dont know. but every single battle with every faction, my opponent and i trade lots of equal missile fire

[MoorsihSultan]

i downloaded test version not , lastest in august month. somebody to tell is everything fixed there
because in export ancilliaries theres many errors for example : sijilmassa is a spawned settlement in the map and Algiers too , but in export ancilliaries between bracket algiers written and outside sijilmassa . it doesnt make any sense

[Jurand of Cracow]

i downloaded test version not , lastest in august month. somebody to tell is everything fixed there
because in export ancilliaries theres many errors for example : sijilmassa is a spawned settlement in the map and Algiers too , but in export ancilliaries between bracket algiers written and outside sijilmassa . it doesnt make any sense

what do you mean by "test version"? The most recent published "test version" is exactly of August 2023.

i was surprised to see most crossbows and bows gain equal range. gives all missile units more competitive ability. does negate the point of longbows though, and crossbows being slower/shorter but harder hitting. good or bad i dont know. but every single battle with every faction, my opponent and i trade lots of equal missile fire

somebody might have messed with it, but I believe crossbows are still slow to reload while being much more armour-piercing and in general doing more damage

Gun units have been nerfed to compared to 6.4 and whoever is responsible for the archer ranges clearly doesn't know the difference between flight and war arrows.

As above, I don't know this. Me, personally, I'm usually conservative ie against untested changes but this might have happened.

What's your policy about including minimods in official releases? Looks like Umbra made some serious work (that's also very relevant to SSHIP's overall objective) here, it would be a shame if this became incompatible with the next release.

Two issues:
- inclusion of the minimod: we're very much in favour. My own minimods were included, kostic's KCC was included etc. Once kostic and umbra on the same page that it's their common vision, we'd include umbra's mod as a core part of the SSHIP.
- compatibility: it will be in umbra's hands to make necessary changes once the new version emerges. It will still be not-eop based, so it should be easy for him to make his mod compatible.

[MoorsihSultan]

what do you mean by "test version"? The most recent published "test version" is exactly of August 2023.

.

what about the settlements names in export ancillary

[Sllhouette]

jurand, do you know if this mod is compatible with the crimson tide blood mod? i use to run it on SS 6.4 so many years ago. i'd like to have it again if possible, but that mod was so old without updates

[Jurand of Cracow]

jurand, do you know if this mod is compatible with the crimson tide blood mod? i use to run it on SS 6.4 so many years ago. i'd like to have it again if possible, but that mod was so old without updates

no idea. graphics is not my specialty.

what about the settlements names in export ancillary

I don't understand, I'm sorry.

[MoorsihSultan]

anyone to help me in scripting , it wont take a long time

[MoorsihSultan]

hey Jurand , can i upload a file in mini mods forum . its a script for the ottoman era . which i tried i did my best ( even i'm noob in scripting ) but it didnt work , the script is another replica for Turcoman Script which contains the most used names for the ottoman sultans and some princes who didnt access to power . i want to leave it here for anyone who wants to make a try . you agree?

[Jurand of Cracow]

of course, everybody can post their minimods / or parts of work in the Mini-Mod subforum. State clearly the version of the SSHIP your work is compatible with.
cheers
JoC

[_TotalWar_]

I SSHIP team! Just wondering, what are the general plans for the mod? Do you consider it to be feature-complete or are there any more things planned for future releases? Just curious, that's all Cheers!

[kostic]

For my part, I will continue to work on the units and their visual aspect. Many things remain to be done, especially beyond the 13th century.
Some factions still deserve attention, like the Scottish for example...

[Sllhouette]

For my part, I will continue to work on the units and their visual aspect. Many things remain to be done, especially beyond the 13th century.
Some factions still deserve attention, like the Scottish for example...

i expect to finish my scottish campaign fairly soon, i'll write up a review of the faction (and of late SSHIP in general)

[vovery]

Some interval thoughts from an ongoing Lithuania campaign without financial aid (I'll post saves later). Bear in mind that these are made from an early game perspective, under 100 turns so far. I'll stick with this campaign, and give an update on thoughts when posting saves.

1. On population growth in early game: IMO chivalry seems a bit too strong as a growth adding factor. It looks like the first level of chivalry adds a +1%, but the more chivalrous a general is, the curve slows down. My general with four chivalry gives a +3% currently according to the settlement details scroll. But when taking into account farming knowledge from the second level onwards, Good Farmer is it, the combination of chivalry + farming knowledge makes populations grow very quickly. Then again, Lithuania starts with a lowly-populated capital + all the rebel settlements around have low populations too, so with the current build from a player perspective I don't mind keeping up with the very effectively growing AI settlements.
   
   Indeed, the quickest way to grow let's say Kolyvan, a motte & bailey with a very low initial population, into a wooden castle or even a castle is currently to let Novgorod take it and let the AI grow it, and conquer it only after it's a castle. The AI generals grow the populations of small settlements very quickly so that the infrastructure of the settlements doesn't keep up with the population growth in order for the AI to be able to upgrade the settlement levels as quickly.
   
   I wouldn't mind it either, if all settlements, be it AI or player, would grow slower. E.g. if the first level of chivalry gave a +0,5% to population growth instead of a +1%, and the curve would be similar to what it's now, a general with four chivalry would give a +2% or +2,5% at max? Then if they have farming knowledge, the squalor-reducing effects would still help. But I understand the effectiveness of chivalry might be needed in mid to late game to maintain larger populations, so it might be hard to try to find a balance.
2. On religious conversion speed: I can confirm the remarks made by other players, and if I'm not mistaken, something is to be tried in the upcoming version? Currently even the pagan Lithuania with less effective shamans compared to catholic/orthodox priests can convert well over half of the population into paganism in just around 20 turns or so after conquering a settlement from a ~10-12% initial paganism state.
3. On Lithuanian family tree: when a Lithuanian male comes of age, there's no new general cost of 1000 florins like there is for other factions. I wonder, if this is intentional? Also a small detail, but the starting wife of the Lithuanian heir is so young that she would've had their firstborn by the age of 10. I have to admit that I haven't looked into it, if this was most likely truly the case. By a quick search there seem to be modern examples of girls giving birth as young as at around 11- or 12-years-old, so I guess 10 shouldn't be impossible either. The world record seems to be a sadly amazing one with Lina Medina giving birth at a bit under 5 years and 8 months.
4. On enemy army composition: for some reason the Polish and Novgorodian armies seem to be lacking archers. I mean yes, their very early game (turns ~16-40) attacking forces come with approximately two archer units per army, but once the player deals with those armies, the AI doesn't seem to either recruit or be able to recruit archers that much. And even when they recruit mercenaries, they seem to prefer spearmen and cavalry, but not that much archers. And Novgorod recruits a lot of slavic javelinmen. Even if there are no archers, their armies usually have at least two or three javelinmen units. Just a few turns ago their attacking army of ~10 units consisted of five javelinmen, a druzhina cavalry, maybe two woodsmen, and two spearmen units. The lack of AI archers makes the battles strongly in favour of the player, who usually wields at least one archer unit into a battle.
5. On watchtowers: I don't know if other players share the thought, but IMO watchtowers might cost too little. I have a watchtower in every strategic position, which makes it easy to shuffle troops between settlements in advance when the enemy armies appear close to the borders or come into my territory. And I never had a problem building the towers even with no financial aid. If they cost 3000 or even 4000 a piece, perhaps the money would've been tighter to invest into watchtowers that much early on. But this could also be just a "problem" with factions/areas with long distances in-between settlements. And it's not really a problem at all, more like a strong advance for the player to not be surprised by enemy armies. Perhaps the hard times are yet to come, even though my reputation is immaculate, and even the relations with the pope are so-so.

On general this version of SSHIP has so far been the best experience I've had, very good job! A really enjoyable campaign now that I've finally grown a thicker skin and play a no reload campaign + avoid abusing the battle AI.

[kostic]

Do you play in VH/VH mode?
Personally, spending 2000 guilders to build a tower is always a tricky choice at the start of the game with the maximum difficulty level. Lack of income, especially if a faction attacks me, is often a problem for me with this version 098 of August 2023...