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  1. #1
    Jozam's Avatar Laetus
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    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    According to polls conducted in the last few years, 85% of Arab citizens of Israel support a Palestinian right of return, which would significantly diminish or even eliminate the country's Jewish demographic majority. Additionally, 75% of Arabs believe Jews have no right to national sovereignty in Israel, and 64% of Arabs (including 72% of Christians) believe a Jewish state is incompatible with democracy. Finally, asked which side they'd take in the event of a defensive war between Israel and Arab countries, only 26% of Arabs picked Israel.

    On the Jewish side, 58% of Israeli Jews believe Arabs who reject Israel as a Jewish state should be stripped of their citizenship — that's 58% of Israeli Jews who support denaturalizing 75% of the Arab population. Two-thirds of Jews believe Arab citizens should not be permitted to buy land either outside of Arab areas (41%) or anywhere in Israel (~25%), while 66% oppose the appointment of Arab ministers and only a quarter are willing to include Arabs in decision-making relating to governance or the economy. These numbers drop further when relating to matters of peace and security, with just 16% of Jews in favor of letting Arab citizens have a say.

    Sources:
    https://www.pewresearch.org/religion...d-public-life/
    https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-706596
    https://jcpa.org/an-in-depth-analysi...s-of-may-2021/
    https://www.timesofisrael.com/poll-6...-nation-state/

    It doesn't look like there's any real Arab support for Zionism, they're just trying to survive and make the best out of a bad situation.

    Ultimately, it's not for nothing that most Israeli Jews are fearful and distrustful of Arab citizens considering if they had their way Israel would cease to be a Jewish state and start to look a lot more like an Arab/Palestinian country.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Hamas attacks southern Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Jozam View Post
    It doesn't look like there's any real Arab support for Zionism
    There are some regional and ethnoreligious pockets of support for Jewish political parties which are all Zionist.

    These are Arab votes from the March 2021 election for example:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    For contrast, this is the Arab vote in the area that is particularly pro-Palestinian:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Source

    Voting for Jewish parties doesn't necessarily mean they would consider themselves to be Zionists, but it arguably reflects a degree of comfort with it.

    In any case, people outside of Israel tend to significantly overestimate the degree to which the conflict plays a role in internal politics. In November of 2023, 54.4% percent of Arabs considered crime and violence to be the most important issue, which is presumably about the rise of gang violence in Arab communities, whereas only 14.7% considered solving the Palestinian problem to be the most important issue (source).

    Quote Originally Posted by Jozam View Post
    they're just trying to survive and make the best out of a bad situation
    Less than ideal, sure, but since 59% of them say they would rather stay in Israel than be granted citizenship in the US or a similar country, it can't be that bad. I occasionally hear some complaining, and polls certainly indicate that to varying degrees they have concerns and/or grievances, but I doubt many of them would want to trade their standard of living for what is common in any of the neighboring Arab countries.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


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