Greece threaten to send jihadists to Western Europe!

**Enros** · March 22, 2015, 12:44 AM

Originally Posted by Ferrets54

Greece does not need more elections. It needs an educated electorate who understand that perennial scapegoating isn't helping.

And which country in the world has one of those?

**~~removeduser_487563287433~~** · March 22, 2015, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by Enros

And which country in the world has one of those?

Although humans are fallible, having - what - four, five elections and each time coming up against some hard realities and falling back on scapegoating? Somebody's going to have to connect the dots at some point.

**Braindead Colonel** · March 22, 2015, 04:18 AM

Originally Posted by Ferrets54

Don't bury your head in the sand everybody can see the thread is totally accurate.

Snide remarks can't hide the sensationalist nature of the thread title.
But when people have an axe to grind, "massaging" the truth is SOP.

**~~removeduser_487563287433~~** · March 22, 2015, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by Braindead Colonel

Snide remarks can't hide the sensationalist nature of the thread title.
But when people have an axe to grind, "massaging" the truth is SOP.

It's not sensationalist. This idiot literally said he would give the necessary documents for anybody to go to the EU, and he explicitly, explicitly mind you, said he would include jihadists. I know you defend any Greek blindly but you really must learn to pick your battles at some point.

**Stavroforos** · March 22, 2015, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by Ferrets54

It's not sensationalist. This idiot literally said he would give the necessary documents for anybody to go to the EU, and he explicitly, explicitly mind you, said he would include jihadists. I know you defend any Greek blindly but you really must learn to pick your battles at some point.

It's really a moot threat though. He has no legal authority to take any of the actions necessary for doing any of that.

**~~removeduser_487563287433~~** · March 22, 2015, 08:44 PM

I take that point but that's shocking - this man is in the cabinet. The fact that this sort of thing comes out on a weekly basis and the world goes "oh well that's what Greeks are like" should be concerning.

**Emperor Arcturus Mengsk** · March 22, 2015, 08:46 PM

Think of him like a republican from the US.

I believe we can find many similarities

**Stavroforos** · March 22, 2015, 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by Ferrets54

I take that point but that's shocking - this man is in the cabinet. The fact that this sort of thing comes out on a weekly basis and the world goes "oh well that's what Greeks are like" should be concerning.

Trust me, the last thing I want to do is give the impression that I'm defending this guy or his party or the people who support him. I have heard from some sources which are close to him that he's like this normally too, that it isn't just some show.

**PointOfViewGun** · March 23, 2015, 04:23 AM

Originally Posted by Stavroforos

It's really a moot threat though. He has no legal authority to take any of the actions necessary for doing any of that.

As if what he wants to do is legal in the first place. He is in a position of power. This is like arguing as if an 17 year old can't shoot someone because he can't legally own a gun.

**Stavroforos** · March 23, 2015, 04:59 AM

Originally Posted by Setekh

As if what he wants to do is legal in the first place. He is in a position of power. This is like arguing as if an 17 year old can't shoot someone because he can't legally own a gun.

Except your example is completely wrong and your understanding of democracy utterly flawed. Literally what you're saying is that anyone who is a minister can do anything because they're a minister. In fact, I shouldn't even be replying to your post since it's so ridiculous.

**PointOfViewGun** · March 23, 2015, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by Stavroforos

Except your example is completely wrong and your understanding of democracy utterly flawed. Literally what you're saying is that anyone who is a minister can do anything because they're a minister. In fact, I shouldn't even be replying to your post since it's so ridiculous.

What's ridiculous is you thinking that government officials function as computer programs with their strict parameters. This doesn't even have anything to do with democracy or how it functions. If this was the Turkish defense minister you'd be arguing something entirely different, and I wouldn't try to come up with excuses. What you're trying to argue here is really ridiculous and senseless.

**Stavroforos** · March 23, 2015, 05:25 AM

Originally Posted by Setekh

What's ridiculous is you thinking that government officials function as computer programs with their strict parameters. This doesn't even have anything to do with democracy or how it functions. If this was the Turkish defense minister you'd be arguing something entirely different, and I wouldn't try to come up with excuses. What you're trying to argue here is really ridiculous and senseless.

First of all, thanks for assuming what I'd be arguing in a hypothetical debate simply because I'm Greek.

Secondly, again, you show a complete lack of understanding of how government, especially democratic government, actually works. The Defense Minister can't implement immigration policy or issue immigration documents any more than the Immigration minister can order troop deployments. When I say that the Defense Minister doesn't have the legal authority, what I'm saying is not that he could still do it illegally, but that he actually has no authority to take any of these actions because he has no such authority from the Constitution. But please, this display of willful ignorance is highly amusing, although rather expected.

**PointOfViewGun** · March 23, 2015, 05:54 AM

Originally Posted by Stavroforos

First of all, thanks for assuming what I'd be arguing in a hypothetical debate simply because I'm Greek.

Secondly, again, you show a complete lack of understanding of how government, especially democratic government, actually works. The Defense Minister can't implement immigration policy or issue immigration documents any more than the Immigration minister can order troop deployments. When I say that the Defense Minister doesn't have the legal authority, what I'm saying is not that he could still do it illegally, but that he actually has no authority to take any of these actions because he has no such authority from the Constitution. But please, this display of willful ignorance is highly amusing, although rather expected.

I am utterly enjoying the irony you present in your post. These are quite naive and ignorant points. Quite telling from the fact that you're unable to address any point raised against you. He's the defense minister. He can do a lot more than a virtual defense minister. He has the power to do everything he said he would. He can either pull strings or have his own department prepare the immigration papers. He can have his units take the custody of illegal immigrants that enter the country and guide them towards Germany. He shouldn't, but he can. He's not the head of security in a mall. He is the defense minister of Greece.

By the way, there is no real immigration minister. Interior minister sets immigration policy. If you think he has the same reach as a defense minister, well, that's an other problem for an other day.

**Stavroforos** · March 23, 2015, 05:55 AM

Originally Posted by Setekh

I am utterly enjoying the irony you present in your post. These are quite naive and ignorant points. Quite telling from the fact that you're unable to address any point raised against you. He's the defense minister. He can do a lot more than a virtual defense minister. He has the power to do everything he said he would. He can either pull strings or have his own department prepare the immigration papers. He can have his units take the custody of illegal immigrants that enter the country and guide them towards Germany. He shouldn't, but he can. He's not the head of security in a mall. He is the defense minister of Greece.

By the way, there is no real immigration minister. Interior minister sets immigration policy. If you think he has the same reach as a defense minister, well, that's an other problem for an other day.

...so, no real argument. Saying that he's the Defense Minister a thousand more times won't give him any more power than he has, sorry.

**AnthoniusII** · March 23, 2015, 06:38 AM

Greece is EU's human depot...The Segen treaty is clear...Greece and Italy have the OBLIGATION to keep imigrants away from the rest of the EU countries.
The problem is that the rest of EU do not give a realistic alternative to Greece and Italy of what they should do to those people that ask refuge in EU...
If Greece and Italy would seal their borders by sinking all ships with such refuges , UN would say that they are Murder Countries.
If these two countries deside that they can not feed those refuges and starve them to death world will say the same (criminal countries).
If these two countries deside that they will give transport papers to those imigrants (that 99% of them do not desire to stay in Italy and Greece), to allow them to travel , EU will say that these two countries brake the treaties and they sent terrorists in their lands. Actually the rest of EU says "If there are terrorists in those immigrants, keep them in your countries no matter the cost of yoursafety because as soon they are in your countries we do not care for more"!!!!!!!!!!!
I haven't see any protest of Germany to Turkey that is the main entrance of terrorists in EU! All EU does is to protest to Greece and Italy!
If Greece will default it will have no reason to keep those imigrants and feed them no matter if they are terrorists or not! Greece will focus to feed its own citizens and sent away the rest!
Ball is in EU's field now! Take it or leave it! Greece (espesialy under default) has nothing to fear from such a movement!

**alhoon** · March 23, 2015, 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by Ferrets54

I take that point but that's shocking - this man is in the cabinet. The fact that this sort of thing comes out on a weekly basis and the world goes "oh well that's what Greeks are like" should be concerning.

I wish it was weekly. I'm so glad it's been two days without national embarrassment!

Originally Posted by Setekh

If this was the Turkish defense minister you'd be arguing something entirely different, and I wouldn't try to come up with excuses. What you're trying to argue here is really ridiculous and senseless.

I disagree with the bold part.