POLAND

[Jurand of Cracow]

I. General information

This thread is meant to gather all information about the faction and to conduct discussions on the faction related issues.
The entries should be developed by both the SSHIP team and the interested players.

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If you like to listen to podcasts, this is a good while short podcast about Polish history in the SSHIP timeframe (made by Canadian British, iirc).

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Poland is a faction providing a player with much fun from building economy and conquering the land around. It starts with several provinces so there’s no initial-rush phase. However, there’re still some rebel provinces around (Halych, Twangste, Goroden) and potential conquest-target neighbours (Lithuania, also stronger Kiev and Hungary). Rather small initial settlements make it rather unlikely that Poland fights on many fronts soon. The diplomatic situation is not straightforward: peace must be made with some factions (historically: HRR and Hungary), which fighting the other ones (Lithuania and Kiev).

[Jurand of Cracow]

II. Strategy & gameplay

The strategies of playing as Poland


You may here read a report from a game with SSHIP 092.



Reporting on ver. 098:

QK - I played recently a Polish campaign and I think the most difficult moment is around 100-150 turns, you may be attacked by everybody if you are not careful and very reliable and have decent relations with your allies. I made a mistake and took over Halych, which lowered my rep to reliable in the wrong moment when most of my neighbors were at peace with everybody. I was attacked immediately by Germans, Denmark and Kiev, with Lithuanian and Novgorod sending stacks close to my border.. Anyway, I gave some money to HRE for peace, lost two cities to denmark, but one reconquered immediately, and the war with Kiev took long time. Lithuanians were my allies so when my rep went to very reliable they didn't attack me, but attacked Novgorod (probably just to do something with their army) so I was saved. But at one moment I thought I am going to lose 5 cities.
It is good also to have an alliance with the Pope and very good relations, because then when you are attacked from the west, the Pope almost immediately orders them to ceasefire. Even the HRE agrees for peace 100% in that case.

[Jurand of Cracow]

III. Provinces

The provinces that have historically been associated with this faction are listed here - it's usually defined by the "faction_creator" in the "descr_strat.txt" file. However, some may be in another faction's thread - due to historical or purely technical reasons.

Provincial titles:
General explanations to be found in the relevant thread on the PTs.
Catholic: If we say that the provincial title should reflect somebody entrusted with care of the province, then the Polish title used in the Middle Ages would be the Latin term “Comes”. It's ok also for the other catholics.
Orthodox: “Knyaz” + name + suffix "skyi". If somebody would collect the historical names, please drop an entry in this thread.
Muslim: generic "Emir of" + settlement name.
Coast of arms: have been reviewed and updated to be as historical as possible.


Kraków (Krakow, Krakow_Province)
PT: Castellanus Cracoviensis - "castellanus" indeed appears in the sources and later it grew up to the most important title in the Commonwealth. Furthermore, using the name "Polonia Minor" could provide sometimes misunderstanding with Polonia Maior.
CoA:
Settlement name: Kraków. (this is perfectly right, even if different spellings existed)
Province name: Polonia Minor (introduced to name the region in 15th century, in the wake of the introduction of the Polonia Maior).
If you want to learn more about Cracow, read this article.
Resources: salt, grain, silver (should be lead, but it's not in the SSHIP).
Fertility: very fertile.
Size:
Initial buildings: I doubt there's a school at that time.
Unique buildings: from 098 Cracow will feature the St Mary Basilica, with 4 stages to be build. You may read an article about this church.

Poznań (Poznan, Poznan_Province)
PT: Comes Poloniae Maior.
Settlement name: Poznań. (this is perfectly right, even if different spellings existed)
CoA:
Province name: Polonia Maior ("Maior" in this case meant "Older". This name was first time recorded in 13th but perhaps used already earlier to distinguish from the other Poland - that one around Kraków).
Resources: ok.
Fertility: ok.
Size:
Initial buildings: .

Wroclaw (Wroclaw, Wroclaw_Province)
PT: Comes Silesiae
CoA: checked and improved.
Settlement name: pl. Wrezlaw, pagan Wortizlava, German Breslau. Actually, many different forms existed, starting with Wrotizlaensem and Wortizlava, and 1133: Vuartizlau, and many, many others. In the 098 three names are implemented.
Province name: Silesia. (this is perfectly right)
Resources: ok.
Fertility: ok.

Plock (Plock, Plock_Province)
PT: Comes Masoviae. Perfect.
CoA:
Settlement name: Plock. Should be Płock, but this letter is not possible to be shown in the M2TW engine.
Province name: Masovia. Perfect, name appeared already in 12c.
Resources: very few.
Fertility: Masovia has had very poor soil and much forests. It was quite underdeveloped until 15th century. Fertility should be very low here.

Szczecin (Szczecin, Szczecin_Province - faction_creator denmark, not really sure about it)
PT: Comes Pomeraniae
CoA: currently is that of Stetin city (I don't know when it was created, but I'd suspect 19 or 20 century), It should be changed into the Griffiths dynasty CoA, which ruled the province throughout the whole period (ca. 1120-1637): red griffin in the white field.
Settlement name: changed to Stetin (no change of either settlement or dominating language: Slavic dynasty - House of Griffins, and the different versions in the sources are actually not so different. Name appears in the sources as: 1123, 1140 Stetin, 1188 Stetyn, 1251 Stitin, also Stitinum, Stitin, Stetina, Stittin. Note that the Polish name Szczecin should not be used because it was created in 19 c.)
Province name: Pomerania (this is perfectly right)
Resources: ok.
Fertility: ok.

Gdansk (Gdansk, Gdansk_Province)
PT: Comes Gedanensis (to signify the importance of Gdańsk, the biggest port on this coast from 15 century onwards. Actually, the city dominated politically the whole area).
CoA: fixed in PTF: two white crosses in the red field.
Settlement name: Gdansk. The name appears in various sources, starting with urbs Gyddanyzc in 997, Kdanzk in 1148, Gdanzc in 1188, Danceke in 1228, Gdansk in 1236, Danzc in 1263, Danczk in 1311, Danczik in 1399, Danczig in 1414, Gdąnsk in 1656. The core always stays and I think the most common is Gdansk. Only in the late Middle Ages we may use somehow germanised name, but it's not necessary. There's a scipt changing name Gdansk into Danczig if taken by non-Polish catholic faction.
Province name: Pomerania Gedanensis given that - to my knowledge - Pomerellen was artificially created in the 2nd part o 15th century to depict a small region, then it was mistaken in a few later atlases, notably Ortelius. I don't know if and when the "Pomerania Gedanensis" has appeared so more research is needed. The previous SSHIP name of Pomerelia appears in the sources in the modern times.
Resources: ok.
Fertility: ok.

A clip about history of Gdańsk (in Polish) - beaware it's a bit popular history, not always keeping academic level. And another one, more on turism.

----------------- Provinces added here so that the HRR thread is not cluttered so much ------------

Olomóc (Olomoc, Olomoc_Province)
PT: Marchio Olomuciensis (from 1182 Moravia was technically a march)
CoA:
Settlement name: Olomóc. That's right even though there're a few medieval versions: Olomuc, Olomucz, Olomuz.
Province name: Moravia. Seems perfect.
Resources: ?
Fertility: ?

Praha (Prague, Prague_Province)
PT: Rex Boemorum. There's no Kingdom of Bohemia in the SSHIP, you may use it for a PT. But I've got heavy doubts. It should be changed into something different.
CoA:
Settlement name: Prague / Praha (script implemented switching betwen the names if Catholic <> Orthodox/Polish)
Province name: Bohemia. That's perfect - the name used already in 10th century.
Resources: rich country, numerous mines. The mines should be possible to upgrade after the Ostsiedlung event. Access to Teutonic Knights, and also to the Joannites. SSHIP097: 2*silver, 1*iron, 1*honey.
Fertility: ok.

Brandenburg (Brandeburg, Brandeburg_Province)
PT: Markgraf von Brandenburg (offical title was Marchio Brandenburgensis)
CoA: not checked.
Settlement name: Brennaburg (Slavic) / Brannenborg (German). Since SSHIP starts 1132 the name should be in Slavic at the beginning, exactly like Liubice. It was rather swiftly changed into Brandenburg. Cölln/Berlin got the importance late, and only in 1451 was named as a seat of the duke, therefore there's no need to change the settlement in the late era. The script changing the name into Brenanborg / Brandenburg has been implemented in SSHIP.097.
Province name: Brannenborg. I conclude that this name was used in the late MA.
Initial number of citizens: ? (it should be very low to reflect the very weak population density and economy of this region)

Liubice (Lubeck, Lubeck_Province)
PT: Herzog von Mecklenburg. This is perfectly right, mentioned in the sources in 14th century.
CoA: not checked.
Settlement name: Liubice/Lübeck/Lübeck. In 12th century the Slavic name is correct but in shold be changed once the settlement is taken by HRR, while stay Lubeka if taken by Poland - such a script is included in the SSHIP 097
Province name: Holstein-Mecklenburg. The bigger part of the current province consists of Meklemburg which developed over centuries but starting only in late Middle Ages. Holstein was just a small part of the current SSHIP province territory and half of it is in the current Sachsen (Hamburg) province. Furthermore, Lubice is on the map to provide for a city important for the Baltic trade and it was Meklemburg as a province (many cities there engaged in this trade). All in all, a name comprised of both names of the provinces seems a good compromise.
Resources: wood, tolls (given the unique geographical placement of Lubeck that enabled to impose it's trade monopoly on other actors, with amber working being the best example). Access to the Teutonic Order since exactly the pilgrims from Lubeck have established the order in the Holy Land in 1189.
Fertility: 2 (not feritile: heavy soils, cold climate, wooded areas).
Size: village. In 1132 Liubice was a very small settlement after having been ravaged by the Rans. In a few years (1143) another settlement was founded 4 km away by the German settlers. The whole province was also very sparsely populated.

[Jurand of Cracow]

IV. Faction specific features (Crown, Offices, Bloodline, Traits, Buildings)

The Crown of Poland is discussed in this entry. The map is below.
To be sure: the elective character of the monarchy developed over the course of 14th century (with the Hungarian king Louis being de facto the first elective king) so in the SSHIP this facet of the faction is not depicted.

An interesting lecture on the coat of arms of Poland is here (in Polish).

The Offices are described in this thread. Poland has a unique (shared with Hungary) title Palatinus instead of Privy Seal.

An idea (not implemented) for the specific offices would be:
Starosta (Steward)
Kanclerz (PrivySeal)
Sedzia (Chancellor)
Komornik (Chambellan)
Skarbnik (Treasurer)
Kasztelan (Seneszal)
Wojewoda (Marshall)
Koniuszy (MoH)

Poland has access to some buildings that may be not available to every faction: Castle Library, University (highest level), Tourney Fields. It also have two unique buildings ("wonders"): Marienkirche in Cracow, and Gniezno Cathedral in Poznan.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Polish Blood: it should be called "Piast blood".

Specific traits: no.




There's an event on the Polish participation in the crusades.

A youtube clip (in Polish, sorry):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Jurand of Cracow]

V. Starting position in 1132 (incl. settlements, armies, generals, traits, political situation)

Settlements: Krakow (capital for the last 80 years), Poznan (former capital), Wroclaw, Plock, Gdansk (recently conquered, with much autonomy).

Family and generals:

Political situation (usurpers etc.)
- the bonds between provinces were not so strong and it was divided a few times (eg. beginning of 12th century), and after 1138 there's a disintegration of the realm. This should be reflected by the usurper system (in 096 it's not)

Diplomacy:
There're doubts if the relations with Hungary shouldn't be better at the beginning (compared to 096).

Religion: at the begining of the 12th century population was mainly pagan. Christianity would achieve majority (50%) only at the end of this century. The situation was different among the elites - these probably were Christian, or at least so thinking of themselves.

[Jurand of Cracow]

VI. Units

Useful links:
Polish roster for the MKTW mod (for Attila) is here.

Polish roster in SSHIP 0.9.2.

Poland has access to:

• Good and numerous feudal heavy cavalry able to make powerful charges (Bodyguards, Piast Nobles, upgraded to Polish Knights, an then to Feudal Knights) – they can be recruited from the cities (Local Recruitment buildings), so there’s a good access even with a couple of LargeTowns (you have two from the beginning) and Castles (another two).
• Good and numerous feudal heavy infantry (Piast Foot Nobles, and it’s upgrades) – as above.
• Average spearmen (Eastern Spearmen, also mercenaries: Mercenary Spearmen and after 150 turns another mercenaries: Prussian Spearmen) – available from the castles, may come in numbers if you build the relevant infrastructure.
• Numerous crappy spearmen (Spear Militia) available from everywhere. This is the infantry you're using at the beginning the most. Later, they have garrison and supplementary ones.
• Decent and numerous shock and anti-armour infantry: axemen are called here Woodsmen – decent quality, armour-piercing axes can kill heavily armoured enemies. They are available from the castles. Since you don’t use them as much as line infantry, the numbers provided are more than enough.
• Crossbows: Crossbow Militia (missile 6) is available quickly form Minor Cities, which Poland has one from the very beginning. Also Mercenary Crossbowmen (8) are available in the land (from v. 096: not anymore).
• Basic archers: at the beginning you’ve only Levy Archers (bow 2), you can hire and mercenary Hunters (2) in the Polish lands, and Balkan Archers (2) from the Hungarian lands, which are nearby.

Initially lack of access, but can be gained quickly:

• Average archers – after you upgrade one of the castles to fortress (Wrocław / Poznań) you gain access to the Lithuanian Archers (3). In the vicinity there’s Gotland island (with Visby) where resource for very good (5) Scandinavian archers is present.
• Javelineers – in the Goroden castle one may recruit Lithuanian Skirmishers (javelin 10). In Volodymyr castle there’re Slavic javelinmen.
• Good crossbowmen – Lettish Crossbowmen (crossbow 8) can be recruited at any castle in Lithuania: one is likely to be taken very soon: Goroden, but the infrastructure can be built after some time (I’ve manged to do it after 100 turns). They come in limited numbers but they don’t die quickly (no melee) so after some time you’ve got enough.
• Horse-archers – at after quite some time (150 turns) the Strzelcy (HC) unit appear and they may play their roles. However, taking Volodymyr castle (just accross the border) gives access to Pechengs, a decent HA.
• Medium cavalry – it’s role can be played by Merchant Militia Cavalry accessible from the Merchant’s Guild (comes comparatively early early to Kraków). Admitedly, this is a crappy cavalry, but later the role of can be played efficiently by Strzelcy (Horse Crossbowmen).
• Medium infantry – as for every European faction, a fortress gives access to Light Men at Arms, in limited numbers.

Lack of access to:

• Good archers – what you can get is max. Attack 3. Other factions have usually 4 or even 5.
• Good spearmen – the available units are rather average.
• Horse-javelins – light cavalry with javelins is not available.
• Light cavalry – only in Scandinavia (eg. Visby) there’re Scouts if a castle is built.
• Shock cavalry – with very high shock and powerful charge, but low melee and defense.
• Archer-infantry – using bows but then good melee infantry.
• Camel riders B-)

To sum up:
the military challenge of this faction lies in the lack of good archers (and other missiles) and of light cavalry, while having average spearmen and average axemen that can fight armoured enemies. However, the access to very good feudal units (both heavy cavalry and heavy infantry) make this faction rather easy to play. Only fighting the Hungarians or steppe people may be a challenge without good archers.

Later, in 15th century, Poland should have some pools of pikes or halberds but they were usualy in low supply.


----- What is changed in the version 097 -------
* units renamed: Piast Nobles -> Możni; Lithuanian Archers -> Forest Archers; Lettish Crossbowmen -> Baltic Crossbowmen, Lithuanian Cavalry -> Lithuanian Riders.
* all buildings provide gradually better units.
* earlier access to: swordsmen (ex-LMaA), but in general no major change in the line infantry roster.
* access to Strzelcy pushed back (ca. turn 170), but access to lesser nobles (Pocztowi) reintroduced (ca. turn 100).
* access to the archers hasn't actually changed, while access to Crossbow Militia added and to Mercenary Crossbowmen taken away.
* access to Peasants removed.
* pool-refill rates lowered (esp. for the Spear Militia).
* more mercenaries will appear, eg. Macemen.

[Jurand of Cracow]

VIII. Reserve

to be used if needed

[Jurand of Cracow]

Units – proposals for modifications

• The main Archery unit for Poland should be the “Hunters” (mercenary – as it is now), or a simple west-European “Archers” should be added. Poland should not have access to Lithuanian Archers in far-away provinces (Poznan, Wroclaw, Stettin), but only in Mazovia (and ofc in Goroden, Lithuania etc.). Of course, after expanding to the other territories, it'll draw on the local archery units (eg. in Hungary, in the Baltics, or in Ruthenia).
• Mercenary Crossbowmen should not be available as mercenaries here for some time (no such people would appear in Poland at that time: too low levels of urbanization). Perhaps after the new drawing techniques are discovered there might be in limited numbers. The Crossbow Militia should be available from the city-level barracks. That would translate in practice into 12^th century Cracow, and perhaps 2+ cities in the 13^th century.
• Lettish Crossbowmen is a fantasy unit until arrival of Teutonic Knights and urbanization of the Baltic coasts. Discussion on this unit is in the Lithuanian section.
• Feudal troops progression: Piast Nobles, Polish Knights and Feudal Knights is a good one. However, each of these types should be available longer. Piast Nobles until the serious changes in the society (mid-13 century), especially in the Local Guard buildings. Polish Knights should exist pararel (as they do in the SSHIP), but the change should be gradual: at the beginning just some of the nobles are better equipped, later more and more. They'd come first to the castles, only after to the cities' Local Guards. The same proces should be applied to Feudal Knights over the 14th century.
• Polish Retainers are for the moment disabled in the roster, but they're in the SSHIP. This is an interesting unit and should be kept. Perhaps under the Polish name Pocztowi.
• The Strzelcy (horse crossbowmen) appear in Poland around 1190, but the information “Mounted Crossbow Developed” in the SSHIP appears around 1210. In history, we’ve got records as late as 15^th century (maybe 14th, but it's contentious). I think the Strzelcy should indeed appear with the Mounted Crossbow event, not earlier. In rather low numbers, from the castles indeed. Later on, they may increase in numbers.
• Light Cavalry (like Scouts in Britain) would perhaps be historical as it was used by the Poles and should be present. However, from the point of the gameplay it may be better not to introduce it as it will provide a challenge for the player and also provide an incentive to expand to the east (to get those Pechengs).
• In 15th century (or earlier, if contacts are made) Poland should have access to the Serbian light-to-medium cavalry (it was called Racowie and developped into the Husarze heavy cavalry of 16-17 c.)
• I think Poland should also have access to Lithuanian Cavalry once it conquers the Baltic lands (for the moment it’s not the case).
• The Pechenegs (horse archers) are available from the castles in Rus (eg. Volodymyr). This makes the steppe HA available for Poland pretty soon as this is the main direction of expansion. I think it shouldn’t be the case as HA were not used in this army. But again - with late Strzelcy, lack of Light Cavalry, and no access to the Lithuanian cavalry - it's ok as it is now.
• Axe Militia could be added to the Spear Milita. The archeological founds have shown that axes were widely used in Poland in the Middle Ages. However, they're used mainly as the secondary weapon, while spears would be primarary (both used with shields). However, to spice up the game for the player, axes can be included more.
• Feudal troops progression: Piast Nobles, Polish Knights and Feudal Knights is a good one. However, each of these types should be available longer. Piast Nobles until the serious changes in the society (mid-13 century), especially in the Local Guard buildings. Polish Knights should exist pararel (as they do in the SSHIP), but the change should be gradual: at the beginning just some of the nobles are better equipped, later more and more. They'd come first to the castles, only after to the cities' Local Guards. The same proces should be applied to Feudal Knights over the 14th century.
• Peasant Infantry is so weak that there’s no point of recruiting it at all. Its an exploit to use them for keeping order in the cities - it should be Spear Militia for this purpose. Remove this unit entirely.
• Levy Archers – they might be marginally useful if a faction does not have (normal / professional) archers. They should be slightly buffed for the fight (missile 2 instead of 1). They should have is_peasant attribute (1/2 effectiveness as a garrison in conjunction with low number of man in a unit will prevent from using it instead of Militia too often).
• Merchant Militia Cavalry - available from the guilds should be changed into a foot unit. The unit has probably been introduced by somebody who knew the Italian military and society: there indeed the merchants would provide weak cavalry units. However, in the Slavic reality, this is a bad choice. Crossbowmen would be the best to replace it accross all guilds.

Some plans are here:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

MERCENARIES:
* there're two areas of recruitment of mercenaries:
Western_Poland: Gdansk, Wroclaw, Poznan, Szczecin
Eastern_Poland: Krakow, Halych, Plock, Hrodna, Volodymyr
* the main problem is that of historicity: there're few roaming mercenaries in the MA, especially in the early times;
* units like Mercenary Crossbowmen should not be available too soon due to the lack of urbanisation;
* there're buffling issues in the list:
- why Macemen are phased out in 1200 while in North Germany they stay till the end of the game? (but in the other parts of Germany until 1200)
- why Mercenary Spearmen are phased out in 1200 while in North Germany they stay till 1470 (and in Ireland or Scandinavia they stey throughout the whole game)?
- why there're not Hunters available in Western Poland?

GUNPOWDER WEAPONS
- first cannons were used in the 80ties of the 14th century.
- first gunpowder infantry is attested in 70ties of the 15th century.

[Hellvard]

• The main Archery unit for Poland should be the “Hunters” (mercenary – as it is now), or a simple west-European “Archers” should be added. Poland should not have access to Lithuanian Archers in far-away provinces (Poznan, Wroclaw, Stettin), but only in Mazovia (and ofc in Goroden, Lithuania etc.). Of course, after expanding to the other territories, it'll draw on the local archery units (eg. in Hungary, in the Baltics, or in Ruthenia).

Agreed, beside that "Hunters" unit. It can remain as it is in terms of model, but name should be changed, maybe just to "Levy Archers". Regular squads made out just of hunters are a pure fantasy

• The Crossbow Militia should be available from the city-level barracks. That would translate in practice into 12^th century Cracow, and perhaps 2+ cities in the 13^th century.

This unit should be avalibale in all cities (basic stone wall level) from the first half of XIIIth century.

• Lettish Crossbowmen is a fantasy unit until arrival of Teutonic Knights and urbanization of the Baltic coasts. Discussion on this unit is in the Lithuanian section.

Exactly

• Feudal troops progression: Piast Nobles, Polish Knights and Feudal Knights is a good one.

No it's not

• However, each of these types should be available longer. Piast Nobles until the serious changes in the society (mid-13 century), especially in the Local Guard buildings. Polish Knights should exist pararel (as they do in the SSHIP), but the change should be gradual: at the beginning just some of the nobles are better equipped, later more and more. They'd come first to the castles, only after to the cities' Local Guards. The same proces should be applied to Feudal Knights over the 14th century.

Piast Nobles are almost ok (some unhistorical helmets) but I don't understand the distinction between Polish Knights and Feudal Knights. Because Polish Knights are just a Polish Feudal Knights You know what I mean? They're just the equivalent of western european feudal knights. So either remove Polish knights unit (which I do not recommend) or remove Feudal knights from polish roster, because it doesn't make sense at all. Polish knights should start just like feudal ones, with full chainmail and pot helmets.

• Polish Retainers are for the moment disabled in the roster, but they're in the SSHIP. This is an interesting unit and should be kept. Perhaps under the Polish name Pocztowi.

Good idea with the unit's name, but they should not be kept like they are now. They are too well armoured and they look to much lithuanian - like. In fact you could use it - this model, just without a knightly lance and with cavalry spear instead would be (almost) perfect representation for a Mazovian Cavalry, a late era light cavalry. Mazovian knights were pretty much indistinguishable from most of other polish knights up to let's say, 1250, but after that, they started to be influenced by prussian, lithuanian and russian ways of warfare. You might say, that there is no more free slots for units, but here's a solution Just remove the Hussars unit. They're a XVI century thing, do your mod reaches that far?
BUT back to the ratainers They should be avalibale early, at first or second level of stables, as a light cavalry, similar to Mounted Sergreants, you can make them use just axes and later swords, if you think Poland would have too many lance cavalry units.

• The Strzelcy (horse crossbowmen) appear in Poland around 1190, but the information “Mounted Crossbow Developed” in the SSHIP appears around 1210. In history, we’ve got records as late as 15^th century (maybe 14th, but it's contentious). I think the Strzelcy should indeed appear with the Mounted Crossbow event, not earlier. In rather low numbers, from the castles indeed. Later on, they may increase in numbers.

I must check if they should not be avalibale some time earlier And indeed, later on their numbers should increase, they were a considerable part of late medieval polish armies.

• The Pechenegs (horse archers) are available from the castles in Rus (eg. Volodymyr). This makes the steppe HA available for Poland pretty soon as this is the main direction of expansion. I think it shouldn’t be the case as HA were not used in this army. But again - with late Strzelcy, lack of Light Cavalry, and no access to the Lithuanian cavalry - it's ok as it is now.

That's right, there were no horse archers on polish armies at all.

• Axe Militia could be added to the Spear Milita. The archeological founds have shown that axes were widely used in Poland in the Middle Ages. However, they're used mainly as the secondary weapon, while spears would be primarary (both used with shields). However, to spice up the game for the player, axes can be included more.

• Peasant Infantry is so weak that there’s no point of recruiting it at all. Its an exploit to use them for keeping order in the cities - it should be Spear Militia for this purpose. Remove this unit entirely.
• Levy Archers – they might be marginally useful if a faction does not have (normal / professional) archers. They should be slightly buffed for the fight (missile 2 instead of 1). They should have is_peasant attribute (1/2 effectiveness as a garrison in conjunction with low number of man in a unit will prevent from using it instead of Militia too often).
• Merchant Militia Cavalry - available from the guilds should be changed into a foot unit. The unit has probably been introduced by somebody who knew the Italian military and society: there indeed the merchants would provide weak cavalry units. However, in the Slavic reality, this is a bad choice. Crossbowmen would be the best to replace it accross all guilds.

Agreed.

MERCENARIES:

* units like Mercenary Crossbowmen should not be available too soon due to the lack of urbanisation;

There should be also a Pavise Crossbowmen unit with upgrade up to half plate armour avalibale for Poland, maybe just as the mercenaries, I'll have to look more into that.

One more thing, I see that there are three halberd units avalibale for Poland, while there should be one at best The halberd came to Poland at the first half of XVth century with mercenaries from former Hussite armies and was never widely spread on our lands, the main polearm in Poland for all of Medieval period was basically a spear. That's why Poland should have a Pavise spearmen (regular, not militia) also with upgrade up to a half plate like Pavise Crossbowmen. But there is a one exception I found some sources about quite a unique polsh unit, Tarczowi Halabardnicy which means "Shield Halberdiers". It was a heavily armoured (from half plate to even full plate) infantry, with small, cavalry pavises and shorter, lighter halberds, which can be used with one hand. But propably you have no more space for new units

[Jurand of Cracow]

I actually agree with all what you've written, Hellward. I'd add even more ;-)

I've just want to point at three issues:
1) Balance with the other factions: making those modifications would require a serious review of the neighbouring factions, like Hungarians, the Rus, Lithuania.
2) Gameplay issues: the progression of feudal units spices up the game for the player a bit as it provides for more variety (ah, a new Polish Knights unit?). Actually, I lack a typical Polish infantry unit in this regard.
3) Modding manpower: making those modifications would require a lot of work.

My proposal were meant to involve the least involvement from any modder: pick the low hanging fruits, just switch some numbers and codes to make it more historical.

[Jurand of Cracow]

I'm just coding the progression of the knights. here is in the local council (city):

 ;- Poland knights --------------------                        recruit_pool      "Polish Nobles"  0.25   0.07   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and not event_counter first_tourney_poland 1
            recruit_pool      "Polish Nobles"  0.25   0.07   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter first_tourney_poland 1 and not event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Polish Nobles"  0.4   0.1   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and not event_counter first_tourney_poland 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Polish Nobles"  0.4   0.1   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter first_tourney_poland 1  and not event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1
            
            recruit_pool      "Polish Knights"  0.5   0.06   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter first_tourney_poland 1 and not event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1
            recruit_pool      "Polish Knights"  0.5   0.09   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1 and not event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1
            recruit_pool      "Polish Knights"  0.5   0.05   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1 and not event_counter MATCHLOCK 1


            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Polish Knights"  0.5   0.07   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter first_tourney_poland 1 and not event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Polish Knights"  0.5   0.1   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1 and not event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Polish Knights"  0.5   0.06   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1 and not event_counter MATCHLOCK 1
            
            recruit_pool      "Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.06   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1 and not event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1
            recruit_pool      "Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.09   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1 and not event_counter MATCHLOCK 1
            recruit_pool      "Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.05   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter MATCHLOCK 1 and not event_counter GOTHIC_ARMOR 1


            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.07   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1 and not event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.1   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter HALF_PLATE_ARMOR 1 and not event_counter MATCHLOCK 1
            recruit_pool      "Dismounted Feudal Knights"  0.5   0.06   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter MATCHLOCK 1 and not event_counter GOTHIC_ARMOR 1

The changes in 097 for Poland will be as follows:

Poland's historical redress:
- two historical events introduced (cracow_location, synod_of_leczyca) to indicate the time of the military transition in the Polish roster,
- Piast Nobles are available for much longer time, Polish Knights come later, and Feudal Knights accordingly later; furthermore, the technological change (Piast Nobles -> Polish Knights -> Feudal Knights) occurs earlier in the castles than in the cities but the dismounted versions disappear at the same time as the mounted ones.
- Strzelcy (Polish Shooters) appear with the Mounted Crossbow event (not Heavy Mail), that means later than previously (turn ca. 170 instead of 100)
- access to the Scouts unit added (otherwised the stables would be useless for those 170 turns);
- Polish Retainers re-introduced in the game (as they were in SS6.4), since they're feudal unit, they're available from castles starting with the Heavy Mail event (turn ca. 100). The unit is called "Pocztowi".
- Poland has access (again as it had in the SS6.4) to the Lithuanian Raiders, although in very limited numbers (1 every 11 turns), and only in Lithuania and Prussia.
- removed recruitment of the Peasant units (keep in mind that the Peasant Archers are called Levy Archers and have 2 missile that makes them a viable unit).
- switched castle vs. town between Plock and Wroclaw; getting rid of roads in Plock (these were dense forests at that time!), a school in Krakow (it was soon to founded, but perhaps not yet);
- some traits introduced to create initial loyalty problems (historically it lead to fragmentation from 1138): civil strife is likely to erupt;
- all in all, in the hands of a player, Poland is now poised to deal with internal problems and population growth, not for expansion (it's already medium-sized: 5 settlements, so it gets no discount on costs of new leader etc).
- information pop-out window if Krakow, Wroclaw, Praga are occupied with some historical flavour (and pics);
- a few new names and surnames introduced, the Polish diacritical characters [ ó, ń, ę, ą, ś, ż ] will feature in the names of the Polish nobles (sadly, no ł ).

[kostic]

Question of an ignorant: how do we know that a unit will appear on turn 170 ? It does not depend on what the player chooses to build in priority ?
Regarding the appearance of Polish nobles on foot and on horseback; the current unit seems to me more suitable for the first half of the 13th century than for a unit of the 12th. What do you think ? I could do one again for the first part of the game ...

[Jurand of Cracow]

Question of an ignorant: how do we know that a unit will appear on turn 170 ? It does not depend on what the player chooses to build in priority ?
Regarding the appearance of Polish nobles on foot and on horseback; the current unit seems to me more suitable for the first half of the 13th century than for a unit of the 12th. What do you think ? I could do one again for the first part of the game ...

Mounted crossbows event happens around 170 (defined in the descr_events)

;- Poland stables -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------        		        recruit_pool  "Scouts"  1   0.13   2  0  requires factions { poland, } and not event_counter MOUNTED_CROSSBOWS 1
        recruit_pool  "Scouts"  1   0.06   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter MOUNTED_CROSSBOWS 1 and not event_counter TRANSITIONAL_ARMOR 1
        recruit_pool  "Scouts"  1   0.03   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter TRANSITIONAL_ARMOR 1 and not event_counter MATCHLOCK 1
		
        recruit_pool  "Polish Shooters"  1   0.13   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter MOUNTED_CROSSBOWS 1 and not event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1
        recruit_pool  "Polish Shooters"  1   0.17   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter synod_of_leczyca 1 and not event_counter HANDGUN 1
        recruit_pool  "Polish Shooters"  1   0.13   1  0  requires factions { poland, } and event_counter HANDGUN 1 and not event_counter ADV_MATCHLOCK 1		
		
        recruit_pool  "Lithuanian Cavalry"  0   0.06   2  0  requires factions { poland, } and hidden_resource lithuania and not event_counter new_era_begins 1

[Krez2445]

Are the early hussar (Serbians) and late professional heavy hussars in .97?

[Jurand of Cracow]

Are the early hussar (Serbians) and late professional heavy hussars in .97?

all units that were in 096 are also in 097

[Krez2445]

all units that were in 096 are also in 097

Is is there a spot where that data is listed?

[Jurand of Cracow]

In the Excel file linked in this entry.

[Just let me post]

Repository idea: faction intro movies
Poland

Hi,
A while ago I had some ambitious intention of making intro videos for every faction (the one that plays when you start the campaign).
The team very much liked the idea, however I was halted by some obnoxious technical issues and obstacles. I said I will give it another go though; therefore this post right here.


The idea is to create simple intro movies, partially inspired by Europa Barbarorum II (faction logo + faction specific music).
Example video I made for Poland

Any help with finding similar songs (~12th century, preferably with singing) for other nations would be most appreciated.
I will try to find and post the music in respective threads, but given my polish background, it will be an increasingely harder task. It will be fun though, finding music always is

[Jurand of Cracow]

I think I'm done with the Poland's reforms. I haven't made the descriptions yet. The effects are partially (ie only for the events 3,4,5) in the EDB, the other are to be developed in the future.
@JLMP: maybe you'd transform your video into a .bik movie and we could add it to the reforms?

    ;====================================================================================================== POLAND EVOLUTION
    ;---------- Poland Evolution
                                                                ; turn 100-150 ostsiedlung
    set_event_counter poland3_first_tourney_player 0            ; turn 180-220
    set_event_counter poland4_location_of_cracow_player 0        ; turn 250-300    
    set_event_counter poland5_council_of_leczyca_player 0        ; turn 300-370
    set_event_counter poland6_united_kingdom_player 0            ; turn 400-470
    set_event_counter poland7_golden_age_player 0                ; turn 560-640


    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 1 STARTING INFO
    ; information about reforms


    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland


        if I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


        if I_TurnNumber = 4
            historic_event POLAND0_STARTING_INFO        
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
        
    end_monitor


    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland


        if I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


        if I_TurnNumber = 5
            historic_event POLAND1_REFORMS_INFO        
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
        
    end_monitor
    
    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 2 OSTSIEDLUNG 
    ; Ostsiedlung (ca. 1180) - higher growth of the settlements
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland


        if I_EventCounter OSTSIEDLUNG > 0                            ; in case any other Ostsiedlung trigger already has fired
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
        
        if I_TurnNumber > 99
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug
        and I_CompareCounter number_p_large_town_built > 3            ; 4+ Local Guards were built (Large Town level)
        and I_CompareCounter number_mines_built > 1                    ; 2+ Mines were build (miners were first people to move east)
        
            historic_event OSTSIEDLUNG
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland_ostsiedlung_player 1
            end_if


            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled hungary                    ; in case the player is Hungary, but it was Poland AI triggering the event
                inc_event_counter hungary_ostsiedlung_player 1
            end_if
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled hre                        ; in case the player is HRE, but it was Poland AI triggering the event
                inc_event_counter hre_ostsiedlung_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor            
        
    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 3 FIRST TOURNEY
    ; First Tourney 1243
    ; it impacts on the possibility to build Tourney Fields and on recruitment of some knights
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland
    
        if I_TurnNumber > 180
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug        
        and I_CompareCounter number_tourney_fields_built > 2        ; Poland has built 3 Tourney Fields (Minor City level)
        and I_EventCounter FL_is_crowned_ruler > 0                    ; FL has the crown
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        and I_SettlementOwner Wroclaw = poland                        ; first tourney was held in Silesia
        
            historic_event POLAND3_FIRST_TOURNEY factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland3_first_tourney_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


        if I_TurnNumber > 240                                        ; FALL BACK - in case of failure or a bug
        and RandomPercent > 90                                        ; to add some randomness against the bugs        
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        
            historic_event POLAND3_FIRST_TOURNEY factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland3_first_tourney_player 1
            end_if    
            
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor    


    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 4 LOCATION OF CRACOW
    ; wave of location of the cities in the wake of Ostsiedlung (1230-1300)
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland
    
        if I_TurnNumber > 250
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug        
        and I_CompareCounter number_city_hall_built > 2                ; Poland has built 3 City Halls (Large City level)
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        
            historic_event POLAND4_LOCATION_OF_CRACOW factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland4_location_of_cracow_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


        if I_TurnNumber > 300                                        ; FALL BACK - in case of failure or a bug
        and RandomPercent > 90                                        ; useful in case of a bug    
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        
            historic_event POLAND4_LOCATION_OF_CRACOW factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland4_location_of_cracow_player 1
            end_if    
            
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor    
    
    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 5 COUNCIL OF LECZYCA
    ; changes in the ecclesiastical life of Poland  (1280-1320)
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland
    
        if I_TurnNumber > 300
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug    
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        and I_CompareCounter number_cathedral_built > 3                ; Poland has built 4 Cathedrals (Large City level)
        
            historic_event POLAND5_COUNCIL_OF_LECZYCA factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland5_council_of_leczyca_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


        if I_TurnNumber > 370                                        ; FALL BACK - in case of failure or a bug
        and RandomPercent > 90                                        ; to add some randomness against the bugs
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        
            historic_event POLAND5_COUNCIL_OF_LECZYCA factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland5_council_of_leczyca_player 1
            end_if    
            
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor    
    
    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 6 UNITED KINGDOM
    ; reunification of Poland under Wladislav the Elbow (1300-1330)
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland


        if I_TurnNumber > 400
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug
        and I_CompareCounter number_citadel_built > 2                ; Poland has built 3 Citadels (Large City castle level)
        and I_EventCounter FL_is_crowned_ruler > 0                    ; FL has the crown
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; Wladislav united 3 provices (no Silesia and Pomerania)
        and I_SettlementOwner Poznan = poland
        and I_SettlementOwner Plock = poland


            historic_event POLAND6_UNITED_KINGDOM factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland6_united_kingdom_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
        
        if I_TurnNumber > 470                                        ; FALL BACK - in case of failure or a bug
        and RandomPercent > 90                                        ; to add some randomness against the bugs
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland
        and I_SettlementOwner Poznan = poland
        and I_SettlementOwner Plock = poland    
        
            historic_event POLAND6_UNITED_KINGDOM factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland6_united_kingdom_player 1
            end_if    
            
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor    


    ;-------------------------------------------------------------------- POLAND 7 GOLDEN AGE
    ; Golden Age of 15th century (1450-1600)
    
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType poland


        if I_TurnNumber > 560
        and RandomPercent > 20                                        ; useful in case of a bug
        and I_CompareCounter number_great_university_built > 0        ; Great University exists (Huge City level)    
        and I_CompareCounter number_cathedral_built > 4                ; Poland has built 5 Cathedrals (Large City level)
        and I_EventCounter FL_is_crowned_ruler > 0                    ; FL has the crown
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland
        
            historic_event POLAND7_GOLDEN_AGE factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland7_golden_age_player 1
            end_if
                
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
        
        if I_TurnNumber > 640                                        ; FALL BACK - in case of failure or a bug
        and RandomPercent > 90                                        ; to add some randomness against the bugs
        and I_SettlementOwner Krakow = poland                        ; at least the capital is in the Polish hands
        
            historic_event POLAND7_GOLDEN_AGE factions { poland, hre, france, england, norway, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, cumans, }
            if not I_IsFactionAIControlled poland
                inc_event_counter poland7_golden_age_player 1
            end_if    
            
            terminate_monitor
        end_if


    end_monitor

[Jurand of Cracow]

Brandenburg (Brandeburg, Brandeburg_Province)
PT: Markgraf von Brandenburg (offical title was Marchio Brandenburgensis)
CoA: not checked.
Settlement name: Brennaburg (Slavic) / Brannenborg (German). Since SSHIP starts 1132 the name should be in Slavic at the beginning, exactly like Liubice. It was rather swiftly changed into Brandenburg. Cölln/Berlin got the importance late, and only in 1451 was named as a seat of the duke, therefore there's no need to change the settlement in the late era. The script changing the name into Brenanborg / Brandenburg has been implemented in SSHIP.097.
Province name: Brannenborg. I conclude that this name was used in the late MA.
Initial number of citizens: ? (it should be very low to reflect the very weak population density and economy of this region)

Second thoughts as usual: if in Prussia we take Twangste, one of many similar settlements in we know about (I'm not sure if it appears in the sources for 12th century, it may be for 13th) and pick it due the the role it gained in the later centuries (from 14th onwards), why do we take Brennaborg that was important in 10-12th centuries, but then other settlements got in the importance?
Just a hesitation, I still think this is a good choice.